Opinion

My view: Pres. Trump has one thing right

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  • HaHaHaHa Othello, WA
    March 21, 2017 4:06 p.m.

    "Donald's bans are not about "immigration", they're about preventing certain religious folks from coming in"..."

    Exactly right 2 bits. And there would have to be about 30+ other countries on the list, that TEMPORARILY restricts immigration, in order for the above statement to be remotely true. Anybody with a half a brain can easily think this one through.

  • 2 bits Cottonwood Heights, UT
    March 21, 2017 9:06 a.m.

    @Ranch
    I asked you which section of the Constitution the executive order violated. And you come back with

    "The part that says the government can't favor one religion over another. Donald's bans are not about "immigration", they're about preventing certain religious folks from coming in"...

    Show me where executive order says what you said...
    Show me where constitution says what you said...
    They don't.

    #1. Executive order doesn't mention religion.

    #2. Constitution doesn't say INS can't consider country of origin.

    You gave something the order didn't say, and something the Constitution doesn't say as your case?

    Constitution:
    The Constitution doesn't say we must not consider country of origin in approving immigration applications. The Constitution says "the government will not establish a State religion". This executive order does not establish a State religion. Sorry.

    Truth is... The executive order doesn't say what you said. And it doesn't violate any part of the actual Constitution.

    And most hilarious of all is Ranch pretending he's just against the order to protect religion.

    Palease...

  • JoeCapitalist2 Orem, UT
    March 20, 2017 6:19 p.m.

    "Americans need to make sure that foreigners who share their values and desire to contribute can get here..."

    Didn't the author get the memo from the far-left that ANY attempt to prohibit anyone from coming to America, whether they share our values or not or have any intention of contributing or not; is just bigotry and racial hatred. We have no right whatsoever to say NO to anyone who wants to come here.

    Our borders must be completely open to everyone in the world or we are all uncaring Islamaphobes. If someone violated our laws and crossed the border illegally or overstayed their visa, then they must be given every right of citizenship or again, we are the bad guys.

    If anyone on the left disagrees, please set the record straight because I have heard nothing from them contradicting this idea.

  • UtahBlueDevil Durham, NC
    March 20, 2017 1:23 p.m.

    "Each immigrant costs the US $75,000 so a reduction of immigrants is helping to pay for the wall. "

    Care to provide the math that supports that?

    I would not disagree that illegal immigration cost us.... but that number is way optimistic. And what it doesn't count is the reduction in cost every American pays in the cost of good via the use of cheap, and often illegal labor.

  • Ranch Here, UT
    March 20, 2017 1:02 p.m.

    @2 bits;

    The part that says the government can't favor one religion over another. Donald's bans are not about "immigration", they're about preventing certain religious folks from coming in.

    The wall, well, that's just to get his base roaring.

  • Vermonter Plymouth, MI
    March 20, 2017 12:57 p.m.

    Re: Muslims and Mormon Missionaries.

    Here in Metro Detroit, with a significant number of Muslims, at least in recent years, and maybe even now, Mormon Missionaries needed Mission President permission to teach Muslims.

    As for "amnesty," for undocumented immigrants, I'm all for it, with (what most undocumented would consider) a very, very minor penalty. That is, permanent residency for life, but no pathway to citizenship (i.e. voting rights and the right to run for public office). America should give them precisely what the undocumented want--"a better life." No need to give them something the vast majority of undocumented couldn't care less about (citizenship).

  • 2 bits Cottonwood Heights, UT
    March 20, 2017 12:35 p.m.

    @Ranch
    RE: "You forgot something. The Constitution"...
    ---
    Can you please cite or quote the part of the Constitution it violates?

    I'm tired of the blanket, "It's unconstitutional"... usually meaning, "I don't like it, so I'm going to call it Unconstitutional".

    Keep in mind that the US Constitution and Bill of Rights only applies to US Citizens.

    Our Constitution can't and doesn't bestow rights upon people of other countries. It protects US Citizens (not refugees living abroad).

    Once they get here and become citizens of the US... THEN it protects them. Not before.

    So now tell me what part of the Constitution it violates...

  • 2 bits Cottonwood Heights, UT
    March 20, 2017 10:43 a.m.

    I scratch my head when people say it's "Unconstitutional" to enforce our laws. But it's Constitutional for President to instruct INS to not enforce laws passed by Congress (as Obama did).

    Orders to NOT obey the law... Constitutional
    Order to obey the law... UN-Constitutional?

    That's backwards.

    DNC want us to not enforce our laws.
    And if we do enforce our laws... it's "UN-Constitutional".
    Is that logical?

    The most amazing thing is... they can find 2 activist judges that agree with that logic!

    That shakes my confidence in our Federal Judges.

    If enforcing the law is unconstitutional... strike down the law. Not the exec order to enforce it.

    Judges do nothing when President orders INS to not enforce our immigration laws.
    But judges block a President who orders INS to do their job and enforce our laws.

    Since when is it UN-Constitutional for President to obey/enforce laws?
    And Constitutional for President to not obey our laws?

    That's crazy!

    If immigration law is unconstitutional... Judges should have stricken them down years ago, not wait for Trump to take office and try to enforce them (IMO).

  • Ranch Here, UT
    March 20, 2017 8:58 a.m.

    Davey;

    You forgot something. The Constitution.

  • What in Tucket? Provo, UT
    March 20, 2017 8:57 a.m.

    Each immigrant costs the US $75,000 so a reduction of immigrants is helping to pay for the wall. The wall should also reduce drug influx which will also help Mexico as it reduces the power of the cartels. For Trump voters he is doing just what we hoped for.

  • 10CC Bountiful, UT
    March 20, 2017 6:54 a.m.

    @Yuge Opportunity Here - it's true that some predominantly Muslim countries ban Mormon missionaries.

    It's also true that in many cultures, the idea of changing religions is considered an insult to ones ancestors. (Think of this as "eternal family values".)

    It's also true that a group of Christian churches in SW India were founded by Jesus' Apostle Thomas, and were largely unknown during what Mormonism considers the Great Apostasy.

    Besides having an unbroken priesthood lineage to Jesus - that was untainted by the Great Apostasy - these "St. Thomas Christians" have their own rituals, and the parents often arrange the marriages of their children... a concept completely foreign to the LDS view of life.

    This isn't to say one group is right and the other wrong. But assuming the rest of the world should conform to your view of what is good and proper is a recipe for disappointment... and/or conflict.

  • UtahBlueDevil Durham, NC
    March 20, 2017 6:51 a.m.

    It is always far easier to be against something, to point out what it wrong, to make snarky comments, to demean those who don't agree with you. It's far harder to actually come up with constructive solutions, to work to fix what is wrong, and to avocate for those issues that impact all. There are many on here I completely disagree with, but I respect those who advocate in positive ways their beliefs. At least you can work with these people, seek to find those areas of common ground.

    With immigration, there are lots of areas where there is common ground. No one is for "open" borders as some profess. Where there is disagreement is the solution to porous borders. You can either invest billions in walls, or you can invest in systems to fix the issues with the current process that has many trying to circumvent it. I am confident the answer lies in the middle somewhere.... plugging the worst vulnerabilities in our borders, all the while resolving issues with letting those come who seek to do jobs that most Americans don't want.

  • IceCreamGhost Sandy, UT
    March 20, 2017 12:36 a.m.

    Immigration is what has made America great. There is no other country that has embraced this as fully.

    As for the fear of muslims - Yes, some muslims out in the world have done horrible things. But so have Christians and Atheists and Hindus and Jews and everyone else over the course of time.
    People are people, and in any group there is going to be a fringe element.

    How do you feel when someone assumes that all Mormons are like Warren Jeffs and the fundamentalists? What you are saying about Muslims is the same thing. It's not fair and the fear-mongering does no one any good.

  • Immifriend Sandy, UT
    March 19, 2017 10:03 p.m.

    A kairos moment -- a moment when the stage is perfectly set for something to be done, or something to be said? We might, indeed, be on the verge of that. If President Trump does continue to push against immigration, and against "illegal" immigration, the moment might arrive when the undocumented push back -- mightily, with a strength we have never seen from them, and are not expecting. Maybe there are already tell-tale signs this could happen.

  • Yuge Opportunity Here Mapleton, UT
    March 19, 2017 3:04 p.m.

    In 1858 William Seward gave a speech in New York titled "The Irrepressible Conflict." It's worth the read.

    He was, of course, talking about slavery and portending the Civil War, but it has some parallels today. Slavery was rife with conflicts; regional, economic, religious, political, moral...

    It's not like the issue today is new or the problems a surprise. Carter, Reagan, Clinton and Bush all had advice from blue ribbon commissions who told them there were problems that were not being addressed.

    So, I appreciate this Opinion piece telling us the time has come to fight...hopefully in Congress, not in the streets.

    The refugee part is easy; set a quota and vet the incoming.

    The illegal alien part is far more complicated. They are just here to work. They don't care about allegiance or loyalty to the American Dream.

    But as years turn into decades and decades to generations, we have retirement and eldercare issues. They haven't prepared themselves and we will be on the hook to provide for them.

  • Yuge Opportunity Here Mapleton, UT
    March 19, 2017 2:49 p.m.

    Um, Imp7, many Muslim countries DO prohibit Mormon missionaries. We don't need to imagine a ban; we're living it. Do you know the penalty in Islam for just listening to a missionary discussion? Ask an RM from Russia what they did when they met someone from a "Stan" nation.

  • Impartial7 DRAPER, UT
    March 19, 2017 12:42 p.m.

    How would this BYU student react if other countries banned mormons? No more missionary programs, except for our neighborhoods. This is nothing but a muslim ban. Otherwise, Trump would have started with Saudi Arabia and Egypt (the countries that the 911 attackers came from). But wait, Trump does business in those countries.

  • marxist Salt Lake City, UT
    March 19, 2017 11:28 a.m.

    Which is more dangerous, immigration or Trump's bizarre behavior?

    The greatest threat to our country and our economy is Donald Trump's temperament. The next greatest threat is the group of radicals who constitute his closest advisors.

    Trump's immigration policy is making enemies globally, hurting U.S. leadership in education and innovation. Foreign students who have flocked here in the past will find other places to go to school. It's already happening. China will be the chief beneficiary.

  • LDS Liberal Farmington, UT
    March 19, 2017 11:18 a.m.

    Davey Runnells is a member of The Millennial Agenda, a millennial-inspired, millennial-driven organization.

    ======

    I curious....

    Will there be walls in the Millennium?
    Borders?
    Passports? Visas?
    Armed Guards? Fences? Barbed-wire?

    What about healthcare for everyone?
    Meals for the poor, sick, needy?

    In the Millennium,
    Will there be a Leader who tells the TRUTH and does not lie daily?
    Who does not bully or treat other people like trash and garbage?

    or will the Millennium consist only of WallStreet elites and Billionaires,
    taking for the poor, and the middle - and fueling their own coffers even more?

    Donald Trump is the anti-thesis to EVERYTHING prophesied about the Millennium.

  • LOU Montana Pueblo, CO
    March 19, 2017 9:15 a.m.

    I had to tell my Trump supporter friends to sit down and read Obama's immigration bill. All of them admitted that they never did. Had they, they would understand that Obama's immigration bill is far more Humane and realistic.

    Trump thrives on hysteria.

  • E Sam Provo, UT
    March 19, 2017 9:03 a.m.

    While I don't quite understand why this moment in history is ripe for immigration reform, there are surely steps we can and should take. First, of course, would be complete and immediate amnesty for all undocumented people, along with a pathway to citizenship without penalty. That absolutely has to come first. Then, we need to invite refugees in who are escaping violence. A couple million would be a start. Meanwhile, let's treat the wall like the sad sick joke it is.
    Our nation is built on immigration. That must continue.

  • Daedalus, Stephen ARVADA, CO
    March 19, 2017 8:46 a.m.

    Smashing the name "Trump" into the phrase "say or do the right thing, at exactly the right time" is the sort of hazardous experiment best left to the professonals at CERN and the controlled environment of the Large Hadron Collider, at least until we understand the potential effects on the space-time continuum.

  • Thomas Thompson SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    March 19, 2017 8:30 a.m.

    Respectfully, I disagree with the idea that "now is the time to take action on immigration." This first became a problem many years ago, when the government adopted a policy of benign neglect regarding illegal immigrants and, as a matter of practice, did not arrest or deport them. That attitude, of course, encouraged millions of other immigrants to enter our country illegally, and the total number of illegals now stands at approximately 11 million. How do we deal effectively with excluding 11 million people from our country? The prospect is daunting, to say the least. It would have been a much smaller problem, and much more easily dealt with, twenty or thirty years ago. The only reasonable solution now would seem to give those already here a path to citizenship -- yes, call it "amnesty" if you like -- and also to build that wall that the President keeps promising that Mexico will pay for.

  • 10CC Bountiful, UT
    March 19, 2017 6:45 a.m.

    This opinion piece is a *great* example of the generalized anxiety and confusion of many Trump supporters.

    While Davey Runnells is motivated to cut off entry, to apply extreme vetting to people from certain countries - or as Trump has advocated, to particular religions - many others fear people like Davey Runnells, or at least those who think the same way.

    Shots fired into a pizza parlor frequented by Muslims, because an Internet rumor suggested a child sex ring was there. A US citizen of Sikh ancestry, shot and told to "go home". (Sikhs aren't Muslim, they're not from the banned countries... but they do kind of look like they could be.)

    Meanwhile, Trump is offending our *friends*, nations we'll need help in fighting actual terrorism.

    Yesterday, at the G-20, our new Treasury Secretary declared that America no longer is interested in free trade. The only point that we could agree on is "trade is a good thing", a primitive concept that pre-dates written language.

    Trump is isolating us on the world stage. Maybe that is his goal.

  • unrepentant progressive Bozeman, MT
    March 19, 2017 6:36 a.m.

    Mr Runnells

    The first thing we need to do is soften up the rhetoric. At which I believe you have failed, and miserably so.

    You freely cast aspersions upon those who find the current administration's actions deplorable.

    However, you remain silent on the speech of those who support the current administration. Where in your opinion piece do you tell those who have harassed legitimately residenced immigrants, and indeed American citizens who just happen to look different from the generic WASP majority? You needn't look hard to find innumerable actions by everyday citizens to impugn the legitimate residency of American citizens and legal resident aliens.

    Where do you tell politicians such as Congressman King of Iowa to tone down? Where do you ask the President to stop the silly talk about Mexico and that wall? Or his campaign rhetoric about Hispanic criminality?

    I agree that we need to have conversations about American identity, but both sides need to cool the hot talk. The right as much, if not more, than the left.

  • one vote Salt Lake City, UT
    March 19, 2017 3:05 a.m.

    Debate should start after Mexico absolutely pays for the wall. His rhetoric and approach is failing miserably.